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Post by ncsu79 on Mar 14, 2012 18:23:58 GMT -5
"I am writing this response today to a group of special Wolfpackers who are passionate about the ‘Pack and who have contacted me.
Many of you have voiced a feeling of distrust for the fairness and impartiality of officiating as related to State basketball.
I wanted to share with you a few updates of our communications with the ACC office, since that is the single most often voiced question.
1. The Commissioner and I most recently met at the ACC Tournament in Atlanta. Before the Tournament, we talked by phone.
2. Regarding the ejection of two former players at the RBC and the initials of that official being on the shoes of officials throughout the opening game of the ACC Tournament, the Commissioner has heard clearly my concerns regarding these matters. As you know, the official was reprimanded and the Commissioner indicated that neither he nor the ACC director of officials was aware that having the initials on the shoes was going to happen.
3. We have begun addressing the widely held view of officiating inconsistencies in the UNC game and will work with Coach Gottfried on that, once we get to a place where we have the ability to focus on it. Right now, we are preparing the film of missed calls/no calls to send to the Director of Officiating at the ACC for his review and feedback.
4. Coach Gottfried has no recollection of being cursed at by an official during the heat of the tournament game. I understand that two media sources tweeted that this occurred and I know the quote they attributed to the official. We will follow up with each media person to seek further details and then share all of that information with the ACC.
5. I have also addressed other issues with the conference such as the bb gun statement made by an opposing coach and the quote regarding how ACC officials “study team tendencies”, something that was disconcerting to a number of fans and to us.
I know you care deeply about your Wolfpack and want you to know that we are expressing our concerns. That is why I wanted to take time to share more detail with you today.
I am so pleased that through adversity we have played our way back into the NCAA Tournament where we belong. I am also proud of our dedicated fan base that is made up of terrific Wolfpackers like you."
I like an AD willing to take issues to the conference office. NCSU is a co-equal founding member of the ACC, and the conference doesn't exist just to showcase Duke and UNC basketball. The last time I checked, we didn't have Washington Generals on our jerseys.
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Post by heelz1 on Mar 14, 2012 18:48:58 GMT -5
This is such an obviously bogus email. Wolfpack fans are willing to go to major extremes with the "conspiracy" theoy....Whup...whup...whupp....wait here come the black helocopters now!
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Post by ncsu79 on Mar 14, 2012 18:53:04 GMT -5
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Post by Marty Da Hungry Wolf on Mar 14, 2012 19:53:17 GMT -5
Birds gotta fly, fish gotta swim, haters gotta hate, sassie gotta have constipation of the brain and diarrhea of the mouth (or, in this instance, keyboard). And so, Simba, that is why it's the circle of life. We eat the antelope, but when we die our bodies become the grass and the antelope eat the grass. Where was I going with this? Oh well ... |
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Post by mattncsu02 on Mar 14, 2012 23:02:21 GMT -5
Debbie is awesome. Nice to see an AD that isn't afraid to speak her mind to the conference.
I met her while tailgating before a football game last year. She talked to us like she had known us for years and before she walked away she shook all of our hands and said, "Thank you for supporting our athletes!" Classy lady.
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Post by heelz1 on Mar 15, 2012 6:09:21 GMT -5
If she did write this her time will be limited. Crying about officiating and buying into the conspiriacy theory is not what an AD should do. I have only seen this by NCSU79 and as we know anyone can use electronic tools and even put himself on the front ot a wheaties box. The remark about Kentucky Colonels is the tip off. Even You could not be this silly! I would at least hope!
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Post by Ken D on Mar 15, 2012 14:13:08 GMT -5
If this email is legitimate, then somebody did her a great disservice for making it public. I believe Yow is in a very difficult position. Regardless of how she truly feels about these issues, she must at least appear to be sympathetic to donors who believe they are being persecuted by the league. Those donors appear to feel that the personification of that persecution is John Swofford, who they believe to be evil because he was once affiliated with the enemy.
That is what in-groups do. They demonize members of the out-group. And they do not tolerate members of their own group who will not do the same. So even if the belief about bias and persecution has no basis, and is indeed counterproductive and self-destructive, she has little choice but to play the game.
I want State to compete for national championships as much as anybody. That doesn't mean I'm a State fan. I want Carolina and Duke to compete for them too, and I'm not a fan of either of these schools either. I'm a sports fan, and around here, that's where the action is. I'm a firm believer in the power of positive thinking. I also understand the power of negative thinking. But that power is destructive, not constructive.
State and its fans don't have to go over to the dark side to stop indulging in concerns about bias, even if its disguised as "standing up for themselves".
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Post by heelz1 on Mar 15, 2012 16:03:24 GMT -5
Agreed. As mentioned above in my earlier post, if she did write this she is not very smart and will not last long. As a leader of the wolfpack sports program she does a disservice to them if she also helps to stir fans up that "everyone " is against the pack. Conspiracy is king.
They need to get to the reality that they just need to play better. Wanna win a golf tournmant...make more birdies...do not complain about the greens!!!!!
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Post by ncsu79 on Mar 15, 2012 16:36:28 GMT -5
I don't think it's "going over to the dark side" to raise questions with the league office regarding legitimate issues. It's not appropriate for refs to show up at a league tournament sporting on their shoes the initials of a colleague who had an issue with a particular team. The "Duke and UNC just don't foul that much" quote by their supervisor is incredible as is the need to view team film. Refs are supposed to see fouls as they occur and call them. No game film preparation is needed.
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Post by heelz1 on Mar 15, 2012 20:36:53 GMT -5
I think officials showing solidarity about an injustice done to a colleague would not be something considered terrible. If it was action would have already been taken. It was known nationally that it occurred.
The wolfpack is quickly getting a name as a team/school that blames all issues impacting its success on others and does not take responsibility itself for inadequacies in its program.
The fact that an AD would buy into the conspiracy nonsense and perpetuate is what Ken is getting at I think. It is not a wise move for her nor the school. Duke and UNC do not get any treatment that state does not receive and to believe so is like thinking there are flying saurcers out there.
And then to use the Kentucy Colnels analogy is quite rediculous!
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Post by mattncsu02 on Mar 15, 2012 22:53:08 GMT -5
I understand everyone's points about the letter and if Debbie should or should not have written it. However, here's what yall need to understand:
Pack fans are extremely hungry for success. We have been for a loooong time. An AD that shows passion for her team and fans is very refreshing for us. We are used to an AD that basically acted like the guy at the party that sits in the corner sipping an O'douls and not talking to anybody. Do you think for one second that if the shoe was on the other foot, the AD's at Carolina and Duke would keep their mouth shut? Heck no! The letter may have been simply a political play, but regardless of the reason behind it, she knows how to rally support from the fanbase.
I think she's looking at a much bigger picture than any conspiracy theories or officiating bias. She's found ways to energize the fanbase and bring a new confidence to State athletics. Remember, she's not employeed by the conference or the media. She works for NC State, and it's supporters/donors/alumni have a lot of influence on how long she is the AD. As long as the Wolfpack family as a whole feels she's doing everything in her power to bring success to the programs, she has job security.
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Post by Ken D on Mar 16, 2012 9:51:23 GMT -5
I hear you, Matt. And I have been reminded on other forums, sometimes rather forcefully, that I can't understand what it's like to be a Wolfpack fan because I haven't suffered with them through the hard times.
And I haven't. My history with the Pack only goes back about 38 years. But I would argue that many of the people citing the LOONG history of suffering don't even go back that far. Many of these date the start of State's troubles to the Valvano era, and what they perceive to be grossly harsh penalties for minor violations.
I have a different take on what drives the Pack's psyche. This "us against the world (ACC)" mentality didn't start in the 80's. It didn't even start in the 70's with the probation that kept the most talented team in the ACC from competing for the national championship. I believe it goes back to the very start of the ACC in the early 50's, and to an extent even before that.
In those days, State wasn't very good in football. They were committed to basketball, and with the hiring of Everett Case, they staked themselves out as the kings of the Southern Conference. But when the ACC was formed, it was the football schools, like Clemson, Maryland and even Duke that led the charge. When other league schools reacted to State's dominance in basketball, they quickly caught up, and even passed State.
That, in my mind, is the genesis of much of today's angst. Not only did somebody supplant State at the top of the basketball heap, but those somebodies were Carolina and Duke, whose fans didn't exactly respect the Wolfpack to begin with.
I don't know if it will ever be possible for State to overcome decades of being made to feel inferior. But I doubt that dwelling on past slights is the way to do it. Yow has a tough job ahead of her, and maybe the best she can hope for in the time she has left is to build a foundation for a future generation of Wolfpack fans to finally achieve equality in their own minds, which is the only place it really matters.
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Post by Marty Da Hungry Wolf on Mar 16, 2012 20:08:01 GMT -5
I hear you, Matt. And I have been reminded on other forums, sometimes rather forcefully, that I can't understand what it's like to be a Wolfpack fan because I haven't suffered with them through the hard times. And I haven't. My history with the Pack only goes back about 38 years. But I would argue that many of the people citing the LOONG history of suffering don't even go back that far. Many of these date the start of State's troubles to the Valvano era, and what they perceive to be grossly harsh penalties for minor violations. I have a different take on what drives the Pack's psyche. This "us against the world (ACC)" mentality didn't start in the 80's. It didn't even start in the 70's with the probation that kept the most talented team in the ACC from competing for the national championship. I believe it goes back to the very start of the ACC in the early 50's, and to an extent even before that. In those days, State wasn't very good in football. They were committed to basketball, and with the hiring of Everett Case, they staked themselves out as the kings of the Southern Conference. But when the ACC was formed, it was the football schools, like Clemson, Maryland and even Duke that led the charge. When other league schools reacted to State's dominance in basketball, they quickly caught up, and even passed State. That, in my mind, is the genesis of much of today's angst. Not only did somebody supplant State at the top of the basketball heap, but those somebodies were Carolina and Duke, whose fans didn't exactly respect the Wolfpack to begin with. I don't know if it will ever be possible for State to overcome decades of being made to feel inferior. But I doubt that dwelling on past slights is the way to do it. Yow has a tough job ahead of her, and maybe the best she can hope for in the time she has left is to build a foundation for a future generation of Wolfpack fans to finally achieve equality in their own minds, which is the only place it really matters. |
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Post by mattncsu02 on Mar 16, 2012 21:39:58 GMT -5
Haha! Nice touch Marty.
I hear you Ken. I think State will overcome the feelings you spoke of. Winning solves a lot of harsh feelings, and with the way the football and basketball programs are improving, the future looks good for the Pack, and it's fanbase of crazies like me.
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Post by Ken D on Mar 17, 2012 9:45:33 GMT -5
Winning certainly helps. Of course, we each have our own definition of what "winning" is. I think schools develop problems when their fans' expectations of what constitutes winning become unrealistic. Carolina is a good example of this, IMO.
In my view, what is realistic for their football program is winning seasons (bowls) most of the time, top 25 ranking occasionally, and being in the hunt for a shot at the conference championship game even more occasionally. It is when powerful alumni decide that's not good enough for them, and believe there is no reason Carolina shouldn't be regularly contending for national championships (despite decades of history that says otherwise) that they start to stretch their view of what kind of behavior is acceptable to accomplish that.
Personally, I think State's goals for football should be pretty much the same as Carolina's (should be). By and large, I think they are. That's why State's record in football, which over the long haul is nearly identical to Carolina's in winning percentage, is much more consistent. Carolina occasionally has a breakthrough season with double-digit wins, while State almost never does. But Carolina also has a bunch of years when they are completely in the tank. That roller coaster ride is, I think, due to overreaching.
I was not an ACC fan when it was formed. I was aware of it, but not living here, I only followed them loosely through the newspapers. The first time I could watch them on TV was the 1957 NCAA's, and that was because Wilt Chamberlain was playing, not because of Carolina. I had only recently become interested in college hoops due to the great Bill Russell teams at San Francisco.
By that time, State's dominance had already begun to slip a little, so I never really "remembered" how good they were in the late 40's. So to me, that kind of consistent dominance was never part of my expectations about the Wolfpack. But when I moved here in the early 70's, it was absolutely the expectation of State fans a little older than myself. Apparently, that expectation is passed down thru generations by some strange biological process we don't quite understand, so that fans born 30 years later still "remember" those good times.
Sports is a funny business, and the older I get the less I understand it.
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Post by mattncsu02 on Mar 18, 2012 23:02:58 GMT -5
Ken, I was either not born yet or too young to remember when State was dominant in basketball. However, I've lived in NC my entire life, and being an ACC basketball fanatic is learned by kids way before reading and writing, haha! My two daughters, 4 and 8, were jumping for joy when the Pack beat Georgetown today....mainly because Daddy was going nuts. Whenever my 8 year old sees something with Carolina on it, she says, "Yuck!" Some of my earliest memories are of sitting in front a TV watching ACC games with my parents. It's just the way it is here. It's the same way in other parts of the country with various sports. For example, people who grow up in Alabama are taught to love 'Bama and hate Auburn, or vis versa. Ever see the ESPN film called "Roll Tide / War Eagle". Now those people are hardcore!
What I've noticed more than anything is that most schools are either a "football school" or "basketball school". How many schools do you know of that are consistantly powerhouses in both sports? I really can't think of any. Look at Kentucky. They are always a top tier basketball team, but the football team is really nothing more than a practice game for most of the other SEC schools between two tough games.
Another thing I have noticed in my short 32 years is that college sports is getting to be more about the money than the athletes and/or fans. It's all about big time TV contracts and merchandise sales. The best players rarely stay a full 4 years before going to the NBA or NFL, especially the NBA. It's a different time to be a sports fan, but even with all the problems with college sports these days, I'll love watching them just as much 20 years from now as I do rightn now.
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